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Thread: Judge Roy Moore: Muslim Ellison Should Not Sit In Congress

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    Default Re: Judge Roy Moore: Muslim Ellison Should Not Sit In Congress

    You begin to wonder if part of this is to see if we are willing to stand up against the tide or cower away. There is a price to pay either way you go.

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    Default Re: Judge Roy Moore: Muslim Ellison Should Not Sit In Congress

    Minneapolis is so far to the left it is out of control, you people have no idea. I am not suprised in the least that we elected the first Muslim to Congress.

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    Default Re: Judge Roy Moore: Muslim Ellison Should Not Sit In Congress

    Catfish has it right ... the 5th district has been *strongly* in DFL (that's "Democrat-Famer-Labor" party in Minnesota) hands since the mid-60s. The fact that Mr. Ellison is Muslim wasn't as important as his being DFL.

    The results didn't come as a surprise to the guys at PowerLine, who ran a series of pre-election articles about Ellison's past and the Minneapolis ("Red Star") Star-Tribune's overly-favorable coverage of the guy, along with their downplaying and avoiding of his past.

    His Republican opponent ("Independent Republican" or "IR" in Minnesota) went strongly for the "he's a Muslim!!" angle ... but simply came off as being "another mean-spirited Republican smear-machine" to the liberal folks of the 5th district. So Ellison was able to play the charming "hey, I'm just trying to run for office and this guy keeps throwing mud at me" guy.

    As for the religious demographics ... it's mostly protestant (Lutheran, for the most part) and Catholic -- which cover a very wide political range ... and I think politics trumped religion in this case.

    Also, one other thing ...

    Quote Originally Posted by Sean Osborne View Post
    He is a radical, anti-establishment, muslim converted white guy.
    Here's a picture of the guy:


    "White guy"?

    -Bryk

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    Default Re: Judge Roy Moore: Muslim Ellison Should Not Sit In Congress

    Quote Originally Posted by Brykovian View Post
    Catfish has it right ... the 5th district has been *strongly* in DFL (that's "Democrat-Famer-Labor" party in Minnesota) hands since the mid-60s. The fact that Mr. Ellison is Muslim wasn't as important as his being DFL.

    http://www.princeton.edu/~rvdb/JAVA/...Multiyear3.gif


    Also, one other thing ...

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Sean Osborne
    He is a radical, anti-establishment, muslim converted white guy.





    Here's a picture of the guy:


    "White guy"?

    -Bryk
    It was the best insult I could come up with at the moment for Islamofascist trash like him.

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    Default Re: Judge Roy Moore: Muslim Ellison Should Not Sit In Congress

    Sean,

    I'm generally not one of those "sue everyone" people.

    But this has got to stop.

    Both those airlines that won't allow the wearing of a cross nor the carrying of a Bible are going to far.

    Hammer time.

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    Default Re: Judge Roy Moore: Muslim Ellison Should Not Sit In Congress

    Are there any doubts?

    http://www.discoverthenetwork.org/Ar...s%20crowd.html

    1st Muslim congressman thrills crowd in Dearborn

    December 26, 2006
    BY NIRAJ WARIKOO
    FREE PRESS STAFF WRITER

    Speaking in Dearborn late Sunday night, the first Muslim elected to Congress told a cheering crowd of Muslims they should remain steadfast in their faith and push for justice.

    "You can't back down. You can't chicken out. You can't be afraid. You got to have faith in Allah, and you've got to stand up and be a real Muslim," Detroit native Keith Ellison said to loud applause.

    Many in the crowd replied "Allahu akbar" -- God is great.

    Ellison, a Minnesota Democrat elected to the U.S. House in November, has been the center of a national debate in recent weeks over Islam and its role in politics. Ellison has said he would take his oath of office on the Quran, the Muslim holy book, igniting a storm of criticism from some commentators.

    U.S. Rep. Virgil Goode, a Republican from Virginia, said in a letter to constituents this month that the election of Ellison and other Muslims poses a danger to the country.

    But Ellison, speaking at the annual convention of the Muslim American Society and the Islamic Circle of North America, said that Muslims can help teach America about justice and equal protection.

    "Muslims, you're up to bat right now," he said. "How do you know that you were not brought right here to this place to learn how to make this world better?"

    The convention, which ended Monday, drew more than 3,000 Muslims from across the country for the event aimed at revival and reform.

    Ellison, who converted to Islam during college, made his remarks at the Hyatt Regency, the site of the five-day convention.

    Ellison said he'd use the Quran during his swearing-in ceremony next week.

    "On Jan. 4, I will go swear an oath to uphold the Constitution of the United States. I'll place my hand on the Quran," Ellison said while placing his hand on the lectern, to loud applause.

    "This controversy has ... made people dust off their Constitution and actually read it ."

    Contact NIRAJ WARIKOO at nwarikoo@freepress.com or 248-351-2998.

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    Default Re: Judge Roy Moore: Muslim Ellison Should Not Sit In Congress

    No doubts whatsoever.

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    Default Re: Judge Roy Moore: Muslim Ellison Should Not Sit In Congress

    The true agenda poking through the cracks?

    This guy and his 'tip of the iceberg' remarks make me nervous.

    Detroit Free Press

    1st Muslim Congressman: I'm not a religious leader

    December 27, 2006
    By Niraj Warikoo
    Free Press Staff Writer

    Detroit native Keith Ellison, the first Muslim elected to Congress, told a group of metro Detroiters on Wednesday that he will not impose Islam on others, but will use the religion to help inform his politics.

    "I'm not a religious leader ..." Ellison said inside Holy Redeemer Catholic Church in Detroit. "I'm not here to be a preacher. But in terms of political agenda items, my faith informs these things."

    Ellison spoke to a group of Arab-American, Muslim, labor, and Catholic leaders at a meeting sponsored by Metropolitan Organizing Strategy Enabling Strength, MOSES, a Detroit-based coalition group.

    Ellison, a Minnesota Democrat, has come under fire in recent weeks for his ties to Muslim groups and for saying he would swear on the Quran, the Muslim holy book, when he takes office on Jan. 4.

    Ellison said Wednesday he intends to use the Quran during the ceremony.

    "I'm a little incredulous about why anyone would care about what I'm going to swear on," he said. "In fact, if I swore on a book that wasn't of my tradition ... would you trust me?"

    Ellison, who converted to Islam while in college, said that he has received three to four hundreds emails every couple of days from people upset with it.

    "People feel extremely threatened by it," he said.

    Ellison also said that he would be serving on the financial services committee in the House of Representatives. He said he wanted to "reinstate human rights in international monetary policy."

    He said he wants to talk "about the IMF (International Monetary Fund) actually helping other nations of the world as opposed to imposing austerity measures on them."

    Ellison said his victory was the result of a diverse coalition that he hopes to sustain.

    Contact Niraj Warikoo at nwarikoo@freepress.com or 248-351-2998.

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    Default Re: Judge Roy Moore: Muslim Ellison Should Not Sit In Congress

    This is a very good read, with many searchable items to further one's understanding.

    http://www.americanthinker.com/2006/...st_beasts.html

    The Coming Perfect Justice
    ByAlamgir Hussain
    December 29, 2006

    Keith Ellison, the first ever Muslim elected to the US Congress, announced his intention of taking the oath of office placing his hand on Islam's supreme holy book, the Quran, when the new 110th Congress convenes in January next year. Instead of 'So Help me God', Ellison, an African American Catholic converted to the Islamic faith, will pledge to uphold the Constitution of the United States ending with the phrase ' Allahu Akbar' meaning 'God is Great' in Arabic.

    The Muslim congressman's stand on taking oath by the Quran created a furor after conservative radio talk-show host Dennis Prager, in an article, titled " America, not Keith Ellison, decides what book a congressman takes his oath on", expressed concern that this "will embolden Islamic extremist" and do "more damage to the unity of America and to the values system that has formed this country.." Mr. Prager however conceded that bringing the Quran alongside the traditional Bible for the swearing ceremony would be sensible. He also argued that Mr. Ellison may take the oath without swearing by anything or even can do away with it altogether to work in his elected position.

    Since then, the media have been flooded with a deluge of commentaries and opinions both condemning and supporting Keith Ellison's choice and Mr. Prager's concerns. In the latest development, conservative Republican congressman, Virgil Goode, from Virginia in an open letter, expressed his concerns for America being swamped by the Quran-wielding representatives in the future. He wrote,





    "...if American citizens don't wake up and adopt the Virgil Goode position on immigration there will likely be many more Muslims elected to office and demanding the use of the Quran.
    "I fear that in the next century we will have many more Muslims in the United States if we do not adopt the strict immigration policies that I believe are necessary to preserve the values and beliefs traditional to the United States of America and to prevent our resources from being swamped.", he continued.




    Being a non-theist, I care little about what book or stuff one uses for the oath, be it the Bible, phone directory, a piece of stone or nothing at all. What concerns me is the fact 'as to why the Muslim congressman must swear by the Quran only and not by another book such as the Bible ' and what it means to the American constitution

    Understanding the basic precepts of the Islamic faith is a precondition to grasp the devout Muslim congressman's stand on taking oath by the Quran. Islam only cares for the truth. Allah, the creator of the universe, undertook the final mission of prophetic succession to deliver the divine message in the perfect form through the last Prophet Muhammad (seal of Prophethood) as the Quran says:




    "Muhammad is not the father of any of your men, but he is the Messenger of God and the Seal of the prophets..." [Quran 33:40]




    In the Islamic belief, the Quran which contains Allah's final messages in unaltered form, is thus, the divine book of complete truth and knowledge of the universe and Islam is the perfect religious guidance chosen by Allah for all mankind:




    This day have I perfected your religion for you, completed My favour upon you, and have chosen for you Islam as your religion. [Quran 5:3]




    When the creator of the universe has chosen Islam as the only perfect religion for the mankind, all other religions, existing before or to appear later, are either false or incomplete and God disapproves them all. Islam has the perfect prescription for every dealing in human life, such as how humans will sit while eating, take bath, do sex, dress up, deal in trades and collect taxes; what they will eat or drink as well as what he must not do. The state will enforce the dos and don'ts of the absolute commander of the universe to run the society in conformity to His wishes.

    The Quran is not only the book of guidance, it is also the book of complete knowledge of the universe. So, the reformist Muslims and their non-Islamic agents have discovered all the formula of modern science, democracy, secularism, human rights and technology in the Quran in recent years. However, the human innovations of the non-Islamic world are naturally fault-prone and are not perfect. Islam only can have these innovations in the perfect form as they come down directly from the knower of all truth. Thus, we have Islamic science, Islamic economy, Islamic banking, Islamic democracy, Islamic human rights, Islamic sex and Islamic technology (Islamic cell phone, TV and fighter jets etc.) in the Islamic world.

    Hence Prophet Muhammad, the earthly editor of the Quran, is increasing being seen as the greatest ever scientist and intellectual in the Islamic world, apart from his being the greatest-ever propeht and man. This upsurge in 'everything Islamic' has much to do with assertions of the Quran like in verses 33:40 and 5:3 cited above. It also goes back to the very inception of Islam. Since Islam is the complete treasure-trove of truth and knowledge, early Muslim conquerors undertook the principle of destroying non-Islamic books or documents they came across. Ali, Islam's fourth caliph and Prophet Muhammad's dearest companion, cousin and son-in-law, had said that extra-Islamic documents or books that contain information absent in the Quran are false and misleading, while others that contained knowledge already in the Quran are unneccesary and hence, they must be destroyed. On this ground, the 3 rd Caliph Othman order the destruction of the massive library of Alexandria (built by Alexander, ~332 BC) after the Muslims' conquest of Egypt in 641.

    Islam also recognizes the period before Islam as the age of Jihiliya (age of ignorance) and a principle of destroying the knowledge, wisdom and customs of period, because of their false or ignoramous nature, were followed during the rule of the first four pious caliphs (till 661), who were the Prophet's companions and trusted friends. After the initial assaults, however, much of pre-Islamic knowledge and intelletaul properties survived during the 90-year rule of the fiercely anti-Muhamamd, anti-Quran godless Omayyads and later the Abbassids. Interestingly, the Abbasids were more Persian than Arab and yet somewhat pious, who preferred the nominally Islamic Mutazili theology over the orthodox Quranic or Muhammedan Islam. They were in great pursuit of learning and were astonished by vast treasures of knowledge and philosophy that existed before the coming of Muhammad. To conform to a core Islamic principle of discarding anything from the Jahiliya age, they collected many of original Greek manuscripts from around the kingdom and overseas, translated them into Arabic and destroyed the original transcripts to create an impression that those materials came from the days of Islam. Hence, many of the original Greek manuscripts do not exists and survived only in the Arabic from which Europeans later translated. The translations were mostly done by the Christian, Zoroastrain (Persian) and Jewish sages employed by the Muslim rulers.

    Here lies the mysteries of how the Islamic world flourished during the Islamic golden age (8-13 th century) despite Islam being such an anti-intellectual, obscurantist and iconoclastic religion. In the 12th century, however, the Quran-based orthodox Islam, revived by great Islamic theologians like Imam Ghazzali (d. 1111 AD), pushed the exercise of philosophy, science and free thought into the back-burner, resulting in the decline of scientific and intellectual progress in the Islamic kingdoms. For example, the proverbial Islamic ruler Saladin of the crusade, a zealous orthodox Sunni, disposed of the famous library of Cairo, consisting of nearly one million books, scrolls and manuscripts after he defeated the Fatimids in 1171 AD. Some were sold, others burned or the rest were left for rotting. [Walker, 284-288].

    Keith Ellison, being a devout Muslim behind his liberal and democratic façade, must be aware of these foundamentals of Islam. The Bible, belong to the Jihiliya age, is full of falsehood and errors. A Muslim should in principle try to destroy such materials and never can he swear by such book of ignorance and falsehood.

    Also in Islam, " The worst beasts in Allah's sight are the disbelievers (8:55)" , who consist of all non-Islamic peoples. Here are more verdicts of the Quran specifically on the Jews and Christians who form the bulk of the American people:




    " Christians and Jews are perverse. Allah fights against them" ( 9:30)

    Jews and Christians are evil-livers. (5:59)

    Christians and Jews must believe what Allah has revealed to Muhammad or Allah will turn them into apes, as he did the Sabbath-breakers. ( 4:47)

    Jews and Christians believe in idols and false deities.. (4:51)

    "Those ( Christians and Jews) are they whom Allah hath cursed." (4:52)

    Allah has stirred up enmity and hatred among Christians. (5:14}

    [Quran 9:29] Fight against such of those who have been given the Scripture (Christian & Jews) as believe not in Allah nor the Last Day, and forbid not that which Allah hath forbidden by His messenger, and follow not the Religion of Truth, until they pay the tribute readily , being brought low.




    Here are a people whom Allah has sorted out as the evil-doers, worthy of apes, the worst beasts and followers of false gods and has cursed and stirred hatred and enmity against. They also do not practice justice (they 'forbid not what Allah has forbidden') and do 'not follow the religion of truth' [Q 9:29]. How could Mr. Prager and his likes in America expect the respectable and devout Muslim politician to swear by the holy book (Bible) of such a people, which also comes from the Jahiliya age? This goes totally against his religious principles. When we recognize Islam as true religion of peace, we must accede to the fact that for instituting the justice and truth of Allah, Muslims must keep fighting the Jews and Christians until they accept subjugation to Islam and pay Jizyah (poll-tax) in humiliation as required by Allah [Q 9:29].

    The Americans must now understand what is expected of this flamboyant Muslim politician from his religious perspective, whom they have sent to the American congress. He has, however, made it clear himself in a Muslim conference in Michigan (23-24 Dec, 2006):




    "Ellison said in Dearborn that Muslims can help teach America about justice and equal protection, suggesting that Muslim activists may be part of God's plan."




    In his firm plan to institute Allah's justice and truth in the American soil, he exhorted the Muslim crowd:




    "How do you know that you were not brought right here to this place to learn how to make this world better? How do you know that Allah, sallalahu aleyhi wasallam," (meaning peace be upon him) "did not bring you here so that you could understand how to teach people what tolerance was, what justice was?... How do you know that you're not here to teach this country?"




    America severely lacks in justice and Mr. Ellison would strive hard with faith in Allah to institute the perfect justice:




    "You can't back down, you can't chicken out, you can't be afraid, you got to have faith in Allah, and you got to stand up and be a real Muslim," Detroit native Keith Ellison said to loud applause.




    And he has the unstinted support of his co-religionists:




    "Allahu akbar" - God is great - was the reply of many in the crowd.




    There is a striking similarity between Ellison's position in America and Prophet Muhammad's in Medina after his relocation there as a refugee in 622 AD. A small band of his followers, including some local converts (helpers/ansars), placed their unstinted support in his leadership. With his unfaltering faith in Allah and in his pursuance of establishing the sole truth and justice of Allah, he had overrun the entire Arabian Peninsula and subjugated and forcefully converted the majority of the people by the time of his death in 632 AD.

    The influential, educated and wealthy Jews of Medina, who had unsuspectingly welcomed him, tasted the bitter and cruel return of their generosity not long after. In 624, Muhammad attacked the Banu Qainuqa clan and wanted to slaughter them en mass. But influential Abdullah Ibn Ubayyi from the Muslims camp, forcefully intervened on the ground of his previous alliance with the Jewish tribe. Much to the bitterness and displeasure of the Prophet, they were allowed to leave in three days, instead being slaughtered. In 626, Banu Nadir faced the same fate and in 628, the last Jewish tribe of and Banu Quraiza was seized, their males (600-900) were all slaughtered; their women and children were taken captives and sold to Nedj for weapons and horses for future battles. In each case, the homes and properties of the Jewish tribes were confiscated as the spoils of war and distributed amongst the participating Muslim fighters according a stipulation revealed by Allah [Quran 8.41].

    This is how the perfect Islamic justice and truth took firm root in Arabia in the early 7th century. Unfortunately, it hasn't yet graced the land of America, which Allah has made so resourceful with his bounty. It is still dominated and dictated by the vile Jews, Christians and worst of all, the atheists.

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    Default Re: Judge Roy Moore: Muslim Ellison Should Not Sit In Congress

    This begs the question: What other Qur’anic messages inspire Keith Ellison?

    http://www.keithellison.org/StribOpEd.htm


    Keith: The value system that's behind my candidacy

    It's about family, faith and a need to work for social justice and the common good.

    Star Tribune
    Published July 19, 2006

    A great deal has been written about me in the press and on political blogs recently. I would like to take this opportunity to speak directly about who I am, rather than have others tell my story.

    My passion for social justice comes from my family. My parents worked
    hard to instill a sense of purpose and pride in me. I grew up hearing the stories of my grandfather who worked with the NAACP in Louisiana, organizing for voting rights at a time when those who stood up could be lynched, and sometimes were.

    Our family proudly tells of the time when a young attorney, Thurgood Marshall, stayed in their home, long before he became a Supreme Court Justice.

    My grandfather's work helped to inspire my commitment to justice and equal rights. I have always tried to live up to his example as an attorney representing the poor and as a state legislator from north Minneapolis.

    As a young man I was outraged and frustrated by the racism and injustice I saw in my community and the world around me. Those experiences propelled me to become a social activist, using my words and actions to draw attention to the very serious problems of inequality, racial injustice and poverty in our society.

    As I matured, I had to confront my anger and face it down. I eventually realized that it is easy to be a critic pointing out problems and failings, but it is a far more difficult thing to be part of creating the solution.

    As my father used to say, "Any jackass can kick a barn down; it takes a carpenter to build it back up."

    Eventually I understood what my father had been telling me, and I committed to being one of the carpenters.

    I began to help create a world where everybody counts and where there are no throwaway people.

    I am still outraged by the direction of our country, but now I channel that outrage into renewing our democracy. I reject the value system that insists it is every man for himself.

    Family is the center of my life. I have been married for 19 years to Kim, my high school sweetheart and closest friend. We have four children, the oldest in college, one at Blake, and two in the Minneapolis public schools.

    My mother and father live three blocks away from my wife's parents in Detroit. When we visit our hometown, our children are lucky enough to run back and forth between the houses of their grandparents.

    People draw strength and moral courage from a variety of religious traditions. Mine have come from both Catholicism and Islam. I was raised Catholic and later became a Muslim while attending Wayne State University. I am inspired by the Qur'an's message of an encompassing divine love, and a deep faith guides my life every day.

    I believe in a value system that invests in people and asks citizens to work for the common good. I decided to run for office because I believe our government has a positive role to play in creating a better future for all people.

    We need leaders who are committed to peace, a clean and sustainable environment, strong public schools and a health care system that works for all people. I am that leader and will continue to be that leader as a congressman from Minnesota.

    Rep. Keith Ellison of Minneapolis, is the DFL-endorsed candidate for Congress in Minnesota's Fifth District.

    Paid for by the Ellison for Congress Committee • contact us
    P.O. Box 11818, Minneapolis, MN 55411

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    Default Re: Judge Roy Moore: Muslim Ellison Should Not Sit In Congress

    I wonder which parts of the Quran they’re gonna seek guidance from?

    And just exactly what do they think they’re gonna teach us?

    And who the f*ck asked them to teach us anything?

    http://www.southbendtribune.com/apps...plate=printart

    Article published Dec 29, 2006
    Muslims told to make stand, work for justice
    New congressman says to keep the faith despite attacks.

    DEARBORN, Mich. (AP) -- The first Muslim elected to Congress returned to his home state and told fellow Muslims to observe their faith and work for justice.

    "You can't back down, you can't chicken out, you can't be afraid, you got to have faith in Allah, and you got to stand up and be a real Muslim," Keith Ellison said in this Detroit suburb, which is the center of Michigan's Arab American community.

    He spoke at a convention of the Muslim American Society and the Islamic Circle of North America, attended by about 3,000 people, the Detroit Free Press reported.

    Born in Detroit, Ellison converted to Islam while in college. He ran successfully as a Democratic candidate for a Minnesota U.S. House seat.

    U.S. Rep. Virgil Goode, R-Va., drew widespread criticism when he challenged Ellison's intention to take the oath of office on the Quran, rather than the Bible. Goode said more Muslims would be elected to office unless immigration was limited.Muslims can expect more attacks in the future, Ellison said.

    "We're going to continue to face them," he said. "They're not going to stop right away. But if you, and me too, stick together, if we believe in Allah ... if we turn to the Quran for guidance, we'll find an answer to the questions we have. And we will find that we are an asset and a plus not only to our own community, but to this country, and to this whole world."

    Ellison said that Muslims can help the nation learn about justice and equal protection.

    "Muslims, you're up to bat right now," he said. "How do you know that you were not brought right here to this place to learn how to make this world better? How do you know that Allah ... did not bring you here so that you could understand how to teach people what tolerance was, what justice was?

    "How do you know that you're not here to teach this country?"

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    Default Re: Judge Roy Moore: Muslim Ellison Should Not Sit In Congress

    I live in MN(not in MPLS) and work in the district referred to.

    Hakim has a long history of being an activist. What people remember him most for was activism against alleged police brutality, and being a voice for the black population.

    As an attorney 13 yrs ago, he represented a young cop killer, and several other nogoodnicks.

    This district is made up largely of minorities and liberals. Hakim was seen as someone who was going to speak for the minorities as well as the liberals.

    He spoke strongly against the war and POTUS. This played well in this particular district, which is probably the most liberal in the country.

    This is the district that elected the empty suit/head Mark Dayton and the late Paul Wellstone.(Anyone recall Bush 1 comments about Wellstone? I believe he was the only person to vote against Dessert storm?) Hakim brought up Wellstone's name on several occasions as did Klobochar.

    Hakim never "wore" his religion on his sleeve. He down played it to the point that the local Jewish group in the district endorsed him in spite of his past anti semite remarks.

    The republican opposition in this district was an older, white Jewish man.

    Hakim's volunteers that I observed doing a lot of the door knocking were young and white.

    WHen I tried to talk to people that lived in the district about Hakim, they told me I was against him because of his race, when my points all had to do with where he was getting his campaign funding, and his potential ties to terrorists. This person told me he only cared that Ellison was black and running for a major office. At no point did race ever cross my mind.

    As much as I tried, I could not get him to see that Hakim could be the political "trojan horse" for the Muslims.



    God please have mercy on this country.

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    Default Re: Judge Roy Moore: Muslim Ellison Should Not Sit In Congress

    Thanks for the insight, Mike.

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    Default Re: Judge Roy Moore: Muslim Ellison Should Not Sit In Congress

    Not only do I believe his religious convictions are suspect, I think his politics suck, and are reflective of a hippy, nanny state, politician.

    My notes are in orange, and inserted in the quotes.

    http://www.keithellison.org/issues-healthcare.htm

    On the Issues:
    Healthcare

    Universal health care coverage is the civil rights issue of our time.
    I didn't know that health care was a civil right...
    http://www.keithellison.org/issues-iraq.htm

    On the Issues:
    Iraq

    Right now nearly everyone from liberal to conservative agrees that the US policy in Iraq is a catastrophic failure. It is clearly the biggest blunder in US foreign policy since Vietnam.

    SNIP

    The fact of the matter is that the only responsible and sound Iraq policy is the immediate withdrawal of all US troops.

    SNIP

    Those that say immediate withdrawal is not a plan are missing the entire point of the argument. Simply withdrawing troops and leaving Iraq on its own is not a plan by itself, but getting the troops out so that we can begin a different approach is the best plan available to us. Immediate withdrawal is not the end of US involvement in Iraq, but the beginning of a new strategy that seeks to quell the violence through more peaceful means. Rather than antagonizing the people of Iraq with our military, we should be bringing all factions to the table and negotiating in a meaningful way.

    We are at stage in human history where the ends no longer justify the means, but one in which means and ends are intimately conjoined. No Pax Americana can bring true peace to world. True peace comes with an olive branch, not with a sword.
    The naiveté - strike that - the plain idiocy in this quote amazes me. That olive branch will make a good target for our enemies if this guy furthers his career.
    http://www.keithellison.org/issues-immigration.htm

    On the Issues:
    Immigration

    I adamantly oppose the Sensenbrenner-King bill in the U.S. House of Representatives. This vindictive legislation must be stopped. I will instead support immigration legislation that provides a clear path to citizenship for the 11 million people who are already in the United States working and paying taxes. I also support an expedited process for family reunification and believe the federal government has an obligation to clear up the backlog of family requests.
    "Vindictive legislation?" "Family reunification?" How in the hell did this guy get elected? And now that he has been elected, our 'new citizens' will be more than happy to keep him in office.

    SNIP

    There are forces in this country who are rabidly anti-immigrant, and politicians who use immigrants as pawns in their political games. These regressive forces have coalesced into a political movement that must be stopped. I will be a strong voice in Congress challenging those forces.
    Color me rabid anti-ILLEGAL-immigration. They always conveniently omit the word "illegal."
    http://www.keithellison.org/issues-choice.htm

    On the Issues:
    Reproductive Rights and Choice

    I am pro choice.
    Murder of the unborn is OK, but he believe "True peace comes with an olive branch, not with a sword."
    Yes Mike; I agree: God please have mercy on this country.

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    Default Re: Judge Roy Moore: Muslim Ellison Should Not Sit In Congress

    Pro-choice, huh? So I guess that means he believes that Muslims will not be killing off their offspring, and hey, taking a liberal stand gains more votes and the lobbyists backing and well, heck, less of all the rest of us procreating. It looks to me like a win-win situation for the furthering of Islam.
    I'm taking America back. Step 1: I'm taking my kids out of the public re-education system. They will no longer have liberal bias and lies like this from bullying teachers when I expect them to be taught reading, writing, and arithmetic:
    To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 15 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

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    Default Re: Judge Roy Moore: Muslim Ellison Should Not Sit In Congress

    FYI:

    http://www.startribune.com/462/story/907052.html

    Area Somalis want peace for homeland

    Many of the 1,500 protesters in Minneapolis were angered that the U.S. gave tacit support for ousting of Islamists.

    By Liz Fedor, Star Tribune
    Last update: December 30, 2006 – 9:45 PM

    More than a thousand Somalis gathered in Minneapolis on Saturday to call for Ethiopian troops to withdraw immediately from Somalia.

    Their protest capped a week in which transitional government troops retook Mogadishu, Somalia's capital, with the backing of Ethiopian infantrymen.

    The U.S. government "gave the green light" to Ethiopia to work in concert with the transitional federal government in Somalia, and that action was "totally wrong," said Hassan Mohamud.

    He is the president of the Somali Institute for Peace and Justice in Minneapolis, which organized Saturday's rally.

    "We ask the president of the United States, Mr. Bush, and his administration to stop supporting the terrorists. Ethiopian troops are terrorists," Mohamud said to a cheering crowd.

    Somali men, women and children gathered Saturday morning in Peavey Park in Minneapolis, and they carried an array of signs. Some said "No more war" and "Islam is the solution."

    Lt. Rick Thomas of the Minneapolis Police Department estimated the crowd at about 1,500 people for a rally that ran for more than two hours.

    Mohamud said he and other Somalis want the United States to support talks that can yield "peace and reconciliation."

    Somalia has not had a stable government in 15 years, but many attendees at the rally said that the Union of Islamic Courts (UIC) had brought some peace to the country during the past six months.

    When that Islamic group took over the capital in June, many people were optimistic about the future, said Omar Jamal, executive director of the Somali Justice Advocacy Center in Minneapolis.

    "They brought back security," Jamal said in a telephone interview. "We were all hoping that the moderates would be able to take the lead in the organization of the UIC. But unfortunately, the radicals hijacked the process."

    Jamal said the large Somali community in Minnesota "is divided," adding that many local Somalis supported the overthrow of the Islamists over the past few days.

    Jamal said he attended the rally as an observer.

    While leaders in the Somali community differ over the best political course of action to take for Somalia's future, many Somalis yearn for a less violent, more stable environment that can better serve the people in Somalia.

    Sadia Egal, 23, said she had been planning to visit her parents in Somalia in January. But the recent military actions prompted her to postpone the trip. She is fearful that her teenage brothers in Somalia could be killed in revenge slayings. "My dad asked them to stop going to school," she said, so they could stay home and avoid being targets for violence.

    Egal, who lives in north Minneapolis, has not returned to Somalia since she left the country with her aunt when she was 12 years old. She works as a parking attendant and interpreter and has been saving her money for six months to pay for her plane ticket.

    Abdullahi Hassan, a small-business owner from Eden Prairie, said, "What brought me here [to the rally] is our country is under occupation by foreign forces." He said the United States should support a process that would allow highly educated Somalis to find solutions to stabilize the country and build hospitals and schools that will serve the people.

    Tacit U.S. approval
    A member of the Somali Institute for Peace and Justice, Abdul Mohamed of Minneapolis, said the military advances last week by Ethiopian troops created "one of the worst moments in Somali history."

    Mohamed disagrees with U.S. policy in Somalia, which he said is driven by "Islamophobia."

    Reports in the New York Times and other news organizations characterized the United States as giving tacit approval to Ethiopia's military actions.

    U.S. Sen. Norm Coleman, R-Minn., has been heavily involved in working with the Minnesota-based Somali community, said Coleman spokesman Luke Friedrich.

    "Clearly, there are many different factions concerned with the future of Somalia, and thus many different voices," Friedrich said Saturday. "In the end, it is in Somalia's interest and America's interest for the country to establish a democratic, secure and functional government -- one where human rights are protected and terrorists cannot get a foothold."

    Liz Fedor • 612-673-7709 • lfedor@startribune.com

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    Default Re: Judge Roy Moore: Muslim Ellison Should Not Sit In Congress

    Ms. Grabar 'got it right'...know your enemy.

    Townhall.Com

    Arrest all jaywalking history professors
    By Mary Grabar

    Sunday, January 14, 2007


    To have a professor get arrested for the crime of jaywalking—especially when the professor has to be subdued and knocked to the ground by back-up police--is about as visually dramatic as it gets at annual conferences like the American Historical Association meeting held earlier this month in Atlanta. This British historian, Dr. Felipi Fernandez-Arnesto, was, in his own words, transported on “a dirty, fetid paddy wagon hand-cuffed to another suspected felon,” and while spending eight hours in jail subjected to humiliating searches, and fed “revolting cellophane-wrapped sandwiches.” This news story was met by the to-be-expected spate of indignant letters to the editor the following day—many charging another abuse of police power. The same day the indignant letters to the editor were published the Atlanta Journal-Constitution published the police officer’s account of the story: the professor did not follow his repeated directions to use a nearby crosswalk to avoid the dangerous stretch of street between the two convention hotels. So goes the historical account—citizens quick to jump on the police before they know the whole story—and the newspaper publishing those letters but not any that followed the policeman’s revelation.

    But historians are guilty of more egregious forms of jaywalking—to use the apt metaphor: distorting history, and their roles as scholars. This group of “scholars” did something decidedly unscholarly at the meeting funded by their universities: they voted in a resolution against war, specifically the Iraq war. The panels consisted of the usual panoply of multicultural, anti-West advocacy, as well. And, thus, many of these scholars share much in common with newly elected Muslim Congressman Keith Ellison who has distorted history for his own purposes.

    Banking on the public’s ignorance of history and the mainstream media’s complicity, Keith Ellison had Thomas Jefferson’s Koran taken out from the Library of Congress under security, for his swearing-in ceremony. In this p.r. stunt he tried to claim Jefferson’s blessing. The mainstream media presented it as another way to upstage what they see as ignorant rubes who would be upset by a Congressman not using the traditional Bible in the swearing-in ceremony. Pulitzer-Prize winner of fragmented bromides, Leonard Pitts, claimed that Ellison’s use of this “Quran” taught us “a surprising fact: Thomas Jefferson owned a Quran.”

    Pitts continued his lecture: “Which probably shouldn’t surprise us at all.

    Jefferson was renowned for his restless intellect and wide-ranging interests. Still, one hopes the tacit reminder that this Founding Father and author of American values did not fear the Quran will silence those who have condemned that book for his swearing-in. One hopes, but one does not expect.”

    Of course. One cannot “expect” of ignorant conservative rubes. For which one has to write in short sentence fragments. Hope only. Someday, maybe—as enlightened as Leonard Pitts. For now, silence them.
    But surprisingly this party line liberal gives a nod of approval to a “Founding Father” as “author of American values.”

    Whoa! Weren’t Jefferson and all the other Founding Fathers supposed to be imperialistic, slave-holding, hypocritical sexist pigs?

    When did Jefferson turn into the archetype of the modern progressive--so open-minded and peace-loving, with a “restless intellect,” that he embraced the “Quran”?

    Apparently, now if one owns a copy of that holy book, it means that he approves of it. Well, I’ve owned copies of Mein Kampf.

    Does that mean I approve of Hitler’s ideas?

    That’s what I had to disabuse a freshman of once as I corrected his paper in which he wrote about the “great man” Adolf Hitler. He apparently was asleep when I told the class that Mein Kampf was an example of propaganda that relied on logical fallacies.

    Mr. Pitts and the imperialistic left-wing editors also need refresher courses in logic and history.

    The Washington Post claimed that this “holy book” has “an unassailably all-American provenance” because it was owned by Jefferson. This congratulatory announcement of Ellison’s “savvy bit of political symbolism” was spread through blogs like the Huffington Post and “Wren’s Nest News.
    Featuring the latest in Witch/Pagan & Mainstream Religious News.”

    While the self-proclaimed intellectuals and profanity-spewing bloggers applauded Ellison’s “savviness,” those who know history and have retained the ability to smell a rat—but not crowned by the Left with Ph.D.’s or Pulitzer prizes--started spreading the truth about why Jefferson might need to refer to his Koran: he needed to know the enemy.

    He needed to understand Muslim pirate slavers off the Barbary states who were pillaging villages and making slaves of non-Muslims: women as concubines and boys who were castrated. They also enslaved the Christian crews of American ships. While John Adams argued for paying tribute, Jefferson argued for war.

    During a 1786 meeting with Sidi Haji Abdul Rahman Adja, the “Dey of Algiers” ambassador to Britain, then American ambassador to France, Jefferson, and American ambassador to Britain, Adams, asked him why Muslims held hostility towards America. They later reported to the Congress that the Dey had answered that Islam “was founded on the Laws of their Prophet, that it was written in their Quran, that all nations who should not have acknowledged their authority were sinners, that it was their right and duty to make war upon them wherever they could be found, and to make slaves of all they could take as Prisoners, and that every Musselman (Muslim) who should be slain in Battle was sure to go to Paradise.”

    After 15 years of payment to the Muslims for passage of ships and ransom for slaves, Jefferson, shortly after his inauguration, deployed American Marines to the Muslim Barbary Coast, where they forced the surrender of Tripoli and freed the American slaves.

    This information prepared in an article posted on a web site by Ted Sampley Special Forces Vietnam veteran made its rounds by emails and found its way to my inbox. Well, this “self-taught writer” (as he described himself to me in an email) gets an A.

    Then Christopher Hitchens presented his own take in Slate a week later.

    But this subject had been covered in a 2005 National Review article, “America’s Earliest Terrorists,” by Joshua E. London. I wonder if Congressman Ellison would like us to follow Jefferson’s lead now. No, there is nothing to “fear” in reading the Koran, Mr. Pitts. I teach portions of it when I teach World Literature. My students are quite surprised to hear that Allah tells men to beat their wives if they think they might be thinking of disobeying them in the future. What the arrogant Congressman is banking on is the ignorance of the American people—that we will take him at his word that Jefferson’s reading of the Koran proves him a “broad, visionary thinker”—i.e., one who would approve of Ellison’s agenda.

    Especially since 9/11, students have been indoctrinated with messages about diversity and the notion that Islam is “a religion of peace”--in contrast to the rapaciousness of the imperialist Judeo-Christian West.

    These lessons trickle down from conferences like the 2007 American Historical Association meeting. There, the panel on “Twentieth-Century Sexualities: A Roundtable on Transnational Identities” presented such learned papers as “Illicit Export: Male Flight Attendants as Globalizers of a Western Gay Identity” and “Queer Peace and the Middle East.” The “Women and War Protest” panel featured the paper, “Cindy Sheehan and the Politics of Motherhood: Republican Motherhood in the Twentieth and Twenty-First Centuries.”

    And a perusal of the jaywalking professor’s own nineteen books reveals a decidedly anti-Western stance. To quote the celebrated professor from the web page on his Dr. S.T. Lee Distinguished Lecture in the Humanities:
    “[T]ime is the past: the future is just the past we have not yet experienced. If there is such a thing as future independent of experience, it can exist only in the imagination, and imagination, as soon as we are aware of it, becomes instantly part of the past. Time and history seem made for each other: mutually nourishing. Time is history’s subject-matter and history is the diet of time.”

    The privileged professors who live in a Marxist wonderland talk to each other in this way. But these inheritors of privilege are cut off from the demands and dangers of the real world—like economic uncertainty, physical labor, or contact with criminals or enemy combatants. The fact that a clear-eyed decorated Vietnam veteran revealed this historical fact about Jefferson—and not some tweed-suited panelist—is quite telling.

    The stereotype of the professor, divorced from reality, but harmless—a sort of Prufrock—seems to dominate the public imagination. But that is not the case.

    We now have a Congressman who has rejected his heritage by a conversion to Islam, worked for Louis Farrakhan, was featured speaker at meetings of Islamic organizations with ties to terrorists, defended six imams staging a stunt, has been appointed the House judiciary committee where he proposes to ban racial profiling (in effect granting immunity to non-Caucasians), and with impunity has misrepresented a historical document. A second generation of indoctrinated students can respond only by bleating slogans from the Red Book of Political Correctness.

    So, I suggest a citizen’s arrest for all jaywalking historians—those who refuse to remain within the lines of truth—for the crime of attempting to lead into the hands of tyranny.

    Mary Grabar graduated from the University of Georgia with a Ph.D. in English and currently teaches at a university in Atlanta.

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    Default Ellison not the first!

    Christian historian corrects error about Muslim congressman

    By Jim Brown
    A leading Christian historian says the news media are inaccurately reporting that Minnesota Democrat Keith Ellison is the first Muslim elected to Congress. WallBuilders says the first congressional Muslim converted to Christianity and became a "zealous advocate" for Christ.
    Hear This Report

    Amid some controversy, Representative Ellison was sworn in last week and, in a private ceremony, took his oath of office using a Koran once owned by Thomas Jefferson. But one history scholar says this is not the first time a person of Islamic faith ascended to a Congressional seat -- nor the first time others have voiced misgivings over the issue.
    Author and historian David Barton is president of WallBuilders, an organization dedicated to highlighting America's forgotten history and heroes, with an emphasis on the moral, religious, and constitutional foundation on which the United States was built. He says the media got their facts all wrong when they declared that Ellison was the first Muslim elected to Congress.
    Actually, Ellison is number two, the history expert contends. "The press is pretty sloppy about researching things," he laments. "They actually just kind of repeat what everybody else is saying. They become a mouthpiece and a parrot for everybody else; but certainly they did not do much research on this, because that's already been an issue. We've already gone through a very similar scenario."
    According to Barton's arguably much more careful research, a Muslim from Virginia served in Congress with some of the founding fathers in the early 19th century, while the United States was engaged in the Barbary Powers War against Islamic despots in North Africa. "Keith Ellison is second," the author insists; "The first guy [of Muslim faith to serve in Congress] was John Randolph of Roanoke," he says.
    In Randolph's time, Barton explains, President Jefferson sent U.S. troops and General William Eaton to Tripoli to battle Muslim terrorists, who were engaging in piracy and extortion, demanding tribute and even holding captured American ships' crews for ransom. In fact, Barton points out, Eaton's military success was the inspiration for the words from the Marine Corps hymn, "From the halls of Montezuma to the shores of Tripoli...."
    Randolph was the son of a rich Virginia tobacco planter and was known to some of his contemporaries as a talented statesman and orator but also as a perpetual outsider and an eccentric. And notes of concern were definitely raised when he, a Muslim, was elected to Congress, Barton notes.
    "Now, significantly," the WallBuilders spokesman says, "in that case -- and again, it was a national issue because we were fighting Muslim terrorists at the time -- it ends up that after several years in Congress, John Randolph of Roanoke got led to Christ by Francis Scott Key, the guy who [wrote the words to what became] the Star Spangled Banner."
    So, although the Virginia elected official was a Muslim when he first began to serve in Congress, Barton observes, eventually "he becomes a Christian and ends up being a very zealous advocate for Christianity." Still, even back then there were those who took issue with Randolph's Islamic faith prior to his conversion.
    And that "déjÃ* vu debate" of 200 years ago was resurrected, Barton says, when Virginia Republican Virgil Goode was criticized in the press for expressing concern over Keith Ellison's election.
    Of course, Goode was "not the only guy who got popped over this," the history scholar notes. "You've also got Dennis Prager," he says, noting that many people are "screaming and hollering" at the conservative columnist and radio talk-show host "because, as a Jew, he's saying [Ellison] should have been sworn in on the Bible."
    Prager's point, Barton asserts, was that "this is America," and that "the Bible is the book of America," the moral foundation on which the nation's governing principle's are based. "Here's a Jewish guy saying that," the historian emphasizes.
    Barton's exhaustive research from original writings on America's founding era have rendered him an expert and a much sought-after consultant on the topic to lawmakers, education officials, and others. Each year, he speaks to hundreds of groups across the U.S. and appears on numerous TV and radio programs in efforts to communicate the truth about America's religious roots and the role individuals can play in reclaiming the nation's spiritual heritage.





    Online since January 13, 2007 at 12:00:02 PM

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    Default Re: Judge Roy Moore: Muslim Ellison Should Not Sit In Congress

    I'll let you decide.

    http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2009/01/08/rep-ellison-makes-pilgrimage-paid-group-critics-extremism/

    Group That Funded Rep. Ellison's Pilgrimage to Mecca Called a Front for Extremism

    Minnesota Rep. Keith Ellison took a trip to Mecca in December that was funded by a group terrorism experts say is tied to the Muslim Brotherhood, an international Islamist movement.

    By Joseph Abrams
    FOXNews.com
    Thursday, January 08, 2009

    Minnesota Rep. Keith Ellison's groundbreaking pilgrimage to Mecca last month was paid for by an American Muslim organization that has ties to Islamic radicals and is "the Muslim equivalent of the neo-Nazi party," his critics say.

    Ellison, a Democrat, became the first U.S. congressman ever to make the hajj pilgrimage when he visited Islam's holy city in December. The trip was funded by the Muslim American Society of Minnesota, a non-profit interfaith group that is one of 55 branches of the MAS nationwide. The pilgrimage was hailed by Muslim activists in the U.S.

    "A U.S. congressman going on hajj sends a very positive message to the Muslim world about America and the religious diversity in America," said Ibrahim Hooper, communications director for the Council on American-Islamic Relations, a Muslim advocacy group.

    But Ellison, the only Muslim in Congress, is coming under fire for his ties to MAS, which one terrorism expert called "the Muslim equivalent of the neo-Nazi party."

    "It is the de facto arm of the Muslim Brotherhood in the U.S.," said Steven Emerson, director of the Investigative Project on Terrorism. "The agenda of the MAS is to ... impose Islamic law in the U.S., to undermine U.S. counterterrorism policy."

    The MAS was founded by members of the Muslim Brotherhood, an international Islamist movement created in Egypt in 1928. Radical members of the Brotherhood founded the terror group Hamas and were among the first members of Al Qaeda.

    The Muslim American Society's former secretary general has acknowledged that the group was founded by the Brotherhood, and in 2004 he estimated that about half of MAS members were in the Muslim Brotherhood.

    "Ikhwan [Brotherhood] members founded MAS, but MAS went way beyond that point of conception," Shaker Elsayed told the Chicago Tribune, explaining that the group had expanded to include a wider viewpoint.

    The Department of Justice has never taken action against MAS and declined to comment on whether it was investigating the group's ties.
    "As a general rule, the Justice Department does not comment on whether or not a particular group or individual is under investigation or has been under investigation," said Dean Boyd, a spokesman for DOJ.

    Ellison gave the keynote address at MAS-Minnesota's conventions in 2007 and 2008, and one of the organization's directors took time off his job to campaign for Ellison during his run for the House in 2006. Ellison was also the first guest on an MAS radio show launched last month.

    Representatives for MAS-Minnesota did not return calls or e-mails requesting comment. But Mahdi Bray, the national director who campaigned for Ellison, denied his group had funded the congressman's pilgrimage, calling the story a "myth" and "urban legend" that needed to be laid to rest.

    "Keith Ellison is a member of Congress who knows that congressmen don't take trips sponsored by nonprofits. That would be a breach of congressional ethics," said Bray, executive director of the MAS Freedom Foundation.

    But Ellison's office told FOXNews.com that MAS had indeed paid for the congressman's hajj.

    "The trip, funded by the Muslim American Society of Minnesota, was fully reviewed and approved in advance by the House Ethics Committee," Ellison's office said in a statement to FOXNews.com.

    The office, which did not say how much Ellison's trip cost, defended MAS as a highly regarded interfaith organization with many ties in Minnesota.

    "The Muslim American Society of Minnesota is a widely respected 501c3 organization incorporated in Minnesota, whose mission is to promote interfaith understanding,"

    Ellison's office said in a statement to FOXNews.com. "The Muslim American Society of Minnesota (MASMN) has an ongoing interfaith project with the Minnesota Council of Churches, and a community outreach partnership with the St. Paul Police Department."

    Ellison's office stressed that prominent Minnesota politicians, including former Vice President Walter Mondale, are close to the MAS. It did not address allegations that MAS has ties to the Muslim Brotherhood.

    Emerson said Ellison's embrace of MAS was an attempt to legitimize the group, which he called out of the mainstream. "It's very troubling that he is trying to project an image of moderation, but he is tied to these radical groups," Emerson told FOXNews.com.

    MAS has stirred up controversy in Minnesota for its activities in the state, including a fatwa, or religious edict, it issued barring Muslim taxi drivers from carrying passengers with alcohol. MAS said in its 2006 decree that Islamic jurisprudence prohibited carrying those passengers "because it involves cooperating in sin according to Islam."

    Click here for more on that story.

    The MAS magazine, "The American Muslim," has printed articles defending "martyrdom operations" to wrest control of Gaza and the West Bank from Israel.

    The Minnesota chapter at one time featured writings from Islamic clerics praising Hamas and urging Muslims to "wage Jihad until death." The postings, which were active as late as June 2007 -- one month after Ellison first addressed the group's convention -- have since been removed.

    Though the MAS Web site has been washed of the religious texts that critics found offensive, Emerson says the group's ties to the Muslim Brotherhood remain intact.

    "Their founding ideologues are all members of the Muslim Brotherhood," Emerson said. "I don't think you can get more radical in the United States without crossing the line to incitement."

    Those accusations have some Muslim activists fuming.

    "If you read the anti-Muslim hate sites on the Internet, every Muslim is the devil incarnate," said Hooper.

    "In general any Muslim who seeks to have positive participation in American society is going to come under attack by those who seek to marginalize and exclude the American Muslim community," he said.

  20. #40
    Super Moderator Malsua's Avatar
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    Default Re: Judge Roy Moore: Muslim Ellison Should Not Sit In Congress

    Backstop,

    No one is surprised. The reason being, it's the elephant in the living room that no one wants to talk about. Liberals even claim the elephant isn't there and conservatives are just trying to create an atmosphere of fear. It still remains that islamic groups raise money for "Charity" that ends up supporting terrorists in just about EVERY case.
    The point is, if a Moo group supplies money to anyone, you can bet it also supports terrorism if not overtly, then tacitly.

    You can bet that much of the money those "Islamic Students" used in the spring and summer of 2001 came from "legitimate" sources. Aren't they just good boys? Going to the USA to learn how to fly airplanes, oh, lets pay all their expenses.

    It's a triangle of evil. Terrorists on one corner, Islamic Charities funding them on another and advocacy groups like CAIR providing cover for both on the third. Of course, the center of that triangle is the white elephant, or perhaps if you will, the green crescent. The Moon god's religion: Islam.
    Last edited by Malsua; January 12th, 2009 at 12:50.
    "Far better it is to dare mighty things, to win glorious triumphs even though checkered by failure, than to rank with those poor spirits who neither enjoy nor suffer much because they live in the gray twilight that knows neither victory nor defeat."
    -- Theodore Roosevelt


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